1 OHIO DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION PRE-BID MEETING Project 340(08) PID 81567 - - - Transcript of proceedings had in the above-entitled cause at the offices of the Ohio Department of Transportation, District 2, 317 E. Poe Road, Bowling Green, Ohio, on Wednesday, April 30, 2008 at 9:34 a.m. - - - _ GREENE REPORTING P.O. BOX 352767 TOLEDO, OHIO 43635-2767 (419) 843-1514 2 1 PANEL: 2 OHIO DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION DISTRICT 2 3 Doug Rogers 4 Brent Downing Dennis J. Charvat 5 - - - 6 P R O C E E D I N G S 7 8 MR. ROGERS: Let's go ahead and get started. 9 I think we've got a pretty good group here. 10 We're here today for the prebid meeting for 11 Lucas 475. And we're calling it the Three 12 Bridges Project. Essentially it's Douglas, 13 Auburn and Central Avenue. And it's also 14 known as Project 340 of '08. And it has a 15 PID number of 81567. 16 And as far as setting up the project, 17 this is part of a lot bigger project which is 18 coming along sometime around 2010 or beyond 19 of reconstruction of 475 in Toledo and 20 reconstruction of 75. But this project is 21 part of the major systems interchange 22 project. 23 We have a Web site on our District 2 24 site link that you can look at details of 25 that project. But, essentially, it will be 3 1 total reconstruction of 475 and 75. So, in 2 preparation we're doing these three bridges 3 to widen out the areas for maintenance of 4 traffic to get ready for that bigger project. 5 Our project engineer development team 6 was HNTB, and Brent Downing was the project 7 manager for that project. ODOT's planning 8 project manager is in the back there, Mike 9 Stormer, and our project engineer for 10 construction is Dennis Charvat. I'm Doug 11 Rogers. I'm with production. I've been 12 production manager during the plan 13 development. 14 And I think I've introduced everybody up 15 here. Why don't we go ahead and start back 16 in the cheap seats in the back and you guys 17 can introduce yourself. We'll go around the 18 room. 19 MR. KING: Tom King, District 2, real estate. 20 MR. HECKERT: Eric Heckert, District 2, 21 testing. 22 MR. HIBBETT: Chris Hibbett, District 2, 23 utilities. 24 MR. STORMER: Mike Stormer, District 2, 25 planning. 4 1 MR. EBERHARDT: Tom Eberhardt, HNTB, 2 construction. 3 MR. FERTAL: Ken Fertal, HNTB. 4 MR. PARCHER: Vince Parcher, the Ruhlin 5 Company. 6 MR. FEBUS: Scott Febus, Welsh Construction. 7 MR. STANARD: Paul Stanard, Great Lakes 8 Construction. 9 MR. WING: Craig Wing, E.S. Wagner. 10 MR. KETHEL: Chuck Kethel, E.S. Wagner. 11 MR. BAEZ: Jorge Baez, Mosser Construction. 12 MR. GILLEN: Larry Gillen, Miller Brothers. 13 MR. WIEMKEN: Jeff Wiemken, Miller Brothers. 14 MR. CRUICKSHANK: Brian Cruickshank, Kiewit 15 Western. 16 MR. WILLIAMS: Mel Williams, Miller Brothers. 17 MR. HINES: Dennis Hines, Miller Brothers. 18 MR. ROGERS: Like I said, it's reconstruction 19 of the three bridges, Douglas over 475, 20 Auburn over 475 and the Ottawa River, Central 21 Avenue, which is also State Route 120. And 22 that spans, obviously, from 75, the Ottawa 23 River, and some of the systems interchange 24 ramps. 25 Our time line, this is quick, but June 5 1 4th is our sale date. The plan package 2 indicates an '08 date, I believe May '08 for 3 the completion date. That is going to be 4 revised after this by addenda. So I didn't 5 want to put that up there. And that was 6 based on an earlier VE session that we were 7 trying to get some things moved forward, but 8 because of the utility conflicts we didn't 9 decide to move forward in that direction. So 10 we're going to revise that date on the 11 completion. I know some people have some 12 concerns with that date. 13 But that's all I have as far as a 14 presentation. And I want to just open it up 15 to questions to you folks. I know it's a 16 pretty good size project and it's very urban 17 in nature. So MOT, obviously, is a big 18 concern for us. There's a lot of utilities. 19 Actually, let me have Chris Hibbett, our 20 utility coordinator, just go over basically 21 some quick things with the utilities. So, 22 before we ask everything, he can give us just 23 a brief overview. Go ahead, Chris. 24 MR. HIBBETT: I'll start with Douglas Road. 25 That has both a gas line and a telephone line 6 1 that's going to need to be relocated off the 2 bridge. The gas line is going to get 3 completely off the bridge and relocate. The 4 phone, they're going to build a utility 5 structure about 25 feet to the west of the 6 proposed structure. So there will be another 7 crossing, aerial crossing across 475 that 8 will have about nine ducts on it, about 25 9 feet off to the west. So that's something 10 you need to consider when you're bidding and 11 your process when you're working your 12 construction. 13 The other two bridges, Auburn and 14 Central, they both have some Edison lines in 15 the sidewalk. Those are going to be 16 abandoned and just some aerial lighting along 17 Central. That will be removed from the 18 project as well. If there are any specific 19 questions about anything else I'll be happy 20 to entertain them. 21 MR. ROGERS: As far as plan changes go, as 22 can be expected, we've got a pretty big 23 addenda coming out. That will be out 24 shortly. Most of the changes are aesthetic 25 in nature. This project has lagged the 7 1 aesthetics behind the major project a little 2 bit. So we have to put those in by addenda. 3 Nothing huge as far as changes. The railings 4 and things like that are going to change. 5 But we'll get those out as soon as we can. 6 We have to go through federal approval on 7 those. It's federal oversight. So once the 8 Feds have approved it we'll put it out for 9 you guys to look at. 10 And there will be also some changes with 11 some additional environmental things coming 12 into play. There's a nationwide that wasn't 13 put into the package that will be placed in 14 there and some other things from the EA for 15 the project. But other than that, 16 everything's out there. 17 We'll get the changes to you as quick as 18 we can. Obviously we want to give you as 19 much time as possible. 20 MR. STANARD: Paul Stanard, Great Lakes. 21 Regarding that aerial structure that you just 22 mentioned, Doug, do you have -- I'm sorry. 23 The gentleman's name? 24 MR. ROGERS: Chris. 25 MR. STANARD: Thank you. When will that be 8 1 erected? 2 MR. HIBBETT: We don't have a schedule for 3 that yet. It is being designed right now. 4 But it will be complete before the sale date. 5 MR. ROGERS: They were targeting the end of 6 April of 2009 to get that bridge in place. 7 So utilities can come off there. Obviously, 8 the overall schedule has been set up to give 9 you guys time for steel lead time. And we're 10 going to -- we're going to give you some 11 more, fine-tune the requirements on windows 12 of time for each bridge with the next 13 addenda. 14 So you kind of understand, that will fit 15 along with the utility plan that's coming out 16 or the utility completion dates that we 17 understand from the utility companies. 18 MR. STANARD: Thank you. 19 MR. HINES: Denny Hines, Miller Brothers. 20 Chris, are those utilities going to be out of 21 the way for the little bit of roadwork there 22 is too? Where are they going to go? 23 MR. HIBBETT: Are you talking AT&T on 24 Douglas? Which one are you talking about? 25 MR. HINES: All of them. Some of the 9 1 utilities are in the way, in the roadway part 2 of it. I know there's not much roadway. But 3 they're in the roadway part of it. Are they 4 going to be moved too? 5 MR. HIBBETT: Yes. There's a little bit on 6 Auburn where we come off the bridge onto the 7 side street. I forget the name of that 8 street. And then there's a little bit on 9 Central. Also, there's those ramps. Those 10 are addressed also in the utility note. 11 MR. HINES: Are you going to put dates on 12 when those are going to be moved? 13 MR. HIBBETT: Those dates are available at 14 the time of the addenda. 15 MR. HINES: We got to have that for our 16 construction. 17 MR. ROGERS: Denny, are you talking about 18 specifically the ones in the road? Do you 19 need more information than what's in the 20 actual utility note? 21 MR. HINES: Yes. I need to know the date 22 those will be relocated. 23 MR. ROGERS: The ones that are in the utility 24 note and any others that we know of? 25 MR. HINES: Right. 10 1 MR. ROGERS: Okay. 2 MR. WILLIAMS: Mel Williams with Miller 3 Brothers. I wasn't sure I understood you 4 completely on that addenda coming out. And I 5 know you talked briefly about putting some 6 time restrictions on the different bridge 7 closures, I'm assuming. 8 Is the completion date -- the completion 9 date in the proposal is October 31st, 2009. 10 Do you anticipate that date changing? 11 MR. ROGERS: That got changed a little bit. 12 We'll look into the date. If you guys have 13 questions with the schedule, that was more 14 along the time line that we expected, October 15 of 2009. We originally had a proposal to 16 move it up a year but that didn't work out, 17 obviously, because of utilities. 18 MR. WILLIAMS: Yeah. I believe that there's 19 restrictions put on the closure limits to the 20 bridges. Right now there really isn't any 21 restrictions. There's a five-month date on 22 Douglas. And then the only other restriction 23 is that Auburn and Central cannot be closed 24 at the same time. 25 MR. ROGERS: Correct. 11 1 MR. WILLIAMS: And if you would restrict that 2 farther, obviously we'd have to look and see 3 how that truly impacts the schedule 4 completion date. 5 MR. ROGERS: Right. I think what's going to 6 affect your dates the most is when the 7 nationwide, when you see the nationwide 8 dates, restrictions in the stream. So I'm 9 not going to comment on that until I put it 10 out officially. I want to make sure Federal 11 Highways looked at it for the official 12 windows that you can't get in the stream. 13 MR. CRUICKSHANK: Brian Cruickshank, Kiewit 14 Western. Going to the streams. Have all the 15 permits been secured for working adjacent to 16 the waterway? 17 MR. ROGERS: Yes. 18 MR. WILLIAMS: Again, Mel Williams, Miller 19 Brothers. On Sheet 13 in the traffic notes 20 it tells you to go to ODOT's Web site for 21 permission, permits for lane closures. I 22 think it's called, gives you the list of lane 23 closures. And then right below that there's 24 a statement that says, there will be no lane 25 closures on mainline between 5 a.m. and 11 12 1 p.m., which then gives you 11 p.m. to 5 a.m. 2 to close lanes. 3 And in that they've shown it as 4 everything is two lanes underneath the 5 bridges. And I don't believe that's true. 6 We've got three and four-lane sections under 7 the bridges because in those three and 8 four-lane sections you are going to have to 9 take out two lanes. And right now, the way I 10 read the Web site, you're only allowed one 11 lane, no two-lane zones are permitted. 12 So I think maybe the, the timing on the 13 lane closures on the mainline and the number 14 of lanes that can be closed within those 15 sections where those bridges are may have to 16 be reviewed. 17 MR. ROGERS: Is your concern the amount of 18 lanes that you can keep open during that time 19 period or is it just the limited amount of 20 time you have to work? 21 MR. WILLIAMS: When I download the 22 information off the Web site, underneath 23 Douglas and underneath Auburn they called 24 that two lanes. Okay. And gave you only -- 25 you were allowed to take out one lane. At 13 1 least by looking at the plans, it shows three 2 lanes under Douglas and I think four lanes 3 under Auburn. And in order to do the 4 contract you're going to have to take two 5 lanes out on the driving side and the passing 6 side in order to execute the work for each of 7 those bridges. 8 MR. ROGERS: Okay. 9 MR. WILLIAMS: And our initial goal, there 10 seem to be some conflict in number of lanes, 11 times you could take them out, that type of 12 thing. I think that whole issue probably 13 needs to be looked at. 14 MR. ROGERS: Okay. 15 MR. WILLIAMS: Again, that's shown on Sheet 16 13. And then they refer you to the Web site. 17 MR. STORMER: We have looked at that already 18 since that came out, and Dennis and I have 19 had conversations. We are looking at 20 revising some of those hours to open up a 21 little bit more time because of the number of 22 lanes. We have looked at that. 23 MR. WILLIAMS: Mel Williams, Miller Brothers. 24 Availability of the existing drawings on the 25 three structures, will they be made available 14 1 to the contractors? 2 MR. ROGERS: Yes. We'll put them out there 3 on the area that you guys can download from, 4 if they still have that open. Do they still 5 have that open with ODOT? 6 MR. WILLIAMS: I'm not a hundred percent 7 familiar with the site. I can navigate it. 8 MR. ROGERS: We'll look out there. If they 9 still have that open we'll put them out there 10 for you guys. Otherwise, they're always 11 available in the district. We'll make sure 12 they're available to anyone that wants to see 13 them. 14 MR. WILLIAMS: I might as well stay on a 15 roll. Mel Williams, Miller Brothers. I 16 noticed on the field painting, which is 17 somewhat limited because this is that A-709 18 steel or A-588 steel, depending on which 19 bridge you're looking at, I think you're just 20 painting fasicas and the areas in front of 21 the abutments. 22 There's a paint warranty on this. I 23 guess our question is, can that warranty be 24 removed since it's a sub paint job, not a 25 prime paint job? 15 1 MR. ROGERS: We'll look into that. 2 MR. WILLIAMS: And the type of painting it 3 is. 4 MR. ROGERS: Yes. We'll definitely look into 5 that. That's a good question. 6 MR. GILLEN: Larry Gillen, Miller Brothers. 7 On Sheet 42 for the Douglas Road project or 8 bridge, the portable concrete barrier as per 9 plan that we're supposed to leave there, the 10 291 feet, it shows that going around the 11 final pier. 12 Will those ends be properly protected 13 when we do that? We're not sure that's going 14 to not create a snag point. 15 MR. ROGERS: Are you talking about during 16 construction? 17 MR. GILLEN: After. When we're done. 18 MR. ROGERS: After. A long-term case. We'll 19 consider that and see what needs to be done. 20 MR. GILLEN: Well, Denny's saying both cases 21 now. 22 MR. HINES: Both during and after. 23 MR. GILLEN: The open -- 24 MR. HINES: We'll still be working on the 25 deck. 16 1 MR. GILLEN: Yeah. I've got three more. 2 MR. ROGERS: Okay. Let's go back to that 3 question. I think, Denny, you mentioned 4 you're still going to be working on what part 5 of it? Just so we can get clarification. 6 MR. HINES: Once we get that pier done and 7 we're working on the deck and we'll still be 8 on the job when that thing's not protected 9 properly. 10 MR. GILLEN: What we're saying is that the 11 final placement -- 12 MR. HINES: When we put the final placement 13 in there we'll still be working on the job. 14 We got liability. If we turn it over to you 15 guys then you got the liability. 16 MR. GILLEN: When we say after, that's when 17 we're done placing it. 18 MR. ROGERS: Okay. Thank you. Go ahead, 19 Larry. 20 MR. GILLEN: Sheet 28, step no. 5, we can't 21 follow that. I think it has to do with the 22 ramp NW versus WN. We don't think that 23 that's what you mean. Are you referring to 24 pier 3? And as we see it, ramp NW is near 25 pier 1. 17 1 MR. ROGERS: We've got that as a question 2 already. We're looking into it. 3 MR. GILLEN: Okay. Sheet 120. The top left 4 refers to limits of temporary slope 5 protection. What temporary slope protection? 6 MR. ROGERS: I think your concern is about 7 the -- it's labeled as temporary protection. 8 The end result is there's going to be a wall 9 there with the major widening project. And 10 we're building a two to one spill through 11 with this project. So it's probably just 12 labeled wrong. You don't like the word 13 temporary, correct? 14 MR. GILLEN: Yeah. We weren't sure what you 15 meant by temporary. 16 MR. ROGERS: The temporary is between this 17 job and the major widening project. 18 MR. GILLEN: Kind of a note to yourself? 19 MR. ROGERS: Right. It's probably the 20 improper use of the word temporary. I know 21 you guys don't like that word. 22 MR. GILLEN: Sheet 78, and it may be on other 23 sheets too, there's a reference to a single 24 parallel ramp in the curb ramps. I go to 25 Sheet 82 and 83 I can find the City of Toledo 18 1 curb ramps for double parallel and 2 perpendicular ramp. But what do you mean by 3 single? 4 MR. ROGERS: We have that as an internal 5 question also that we're looking into. 6 MR. GILLEN: Okay. 7 MR. ROGERS: Thanks for pointing that out. 8 MR. GILLEN: Okay. That's it for now. 9 Thank you. 10 MR. ROGERS: Thank you. 11 MR. WILLIAMS: Mel Williams, Miller Brothers. 12 On all of the general note pages for the 13 bridges, for each bridge they've got a note 14 in there that says no hoerams will be allowed 15 to be used for the demolition. 16 And my question would be, can hoerams be 17 used on demolition of elements that are 18 completely removed and not in contact with 19 anything that's going to be salvaged? It's 20 just a standard note that's probably copied 21 in. 22 MR. ROGERS: That's a good question. And we 23 talked about that internally. I want to get 24 a confirmation from our bridge structural 25 group, HNTB, before I answer it. But I'll 19 1 answer that. Obviously it's been asked as an 2 official question already as well. 3 MR. WILLIAMS: I think I have one more. On 4 Sheet 13, just to confirm that that's what 5 needs to be done, under Maintenance of 6 Traffic, second paragraph from the bottom, 7 first column, it says, contractor shall 8 provide detour signs for official local road 9 detours as detailed in plans. Detour signs 10 for the official road shall be installed and 11 removed by the City of Toledo forces. 12 Is that a correct statement? We're 13 going to provide all the signing for the 14 detour and then the City of Toledo is going 15 to place it and remove it? 16 MR. ROGERS: That's the way it stands right 17 now. We've been working with the city on 18 this project. Are there any concerns on your 19 part with the way that's set up? 20 MR. WILLIAMS: No. I just want to confirm 21 that that's how we would assume that. 22 MR. ROGERS: Yes. 23 MR. WILLIAMS: Was a little different note. 24 MR. HINES: Denny Hines, Miller Brothers. 25 Are we going to get those signs back when 20 1 they're done with them? And if they get hit, 2 are we responsible to replace them? 3 MR. ROGERS: We will clarify those questions. 4 MR. WING: Craig Wing, E.S. Wagner. Follow 5 up to that. Is that the -- we're talking 6 about the local detour only? You showed two 7 detour routes in the plans. I'm assuming 8 you're talking about the local only with 9 these signs? 10 MR. ROGERS: The way it stands now is it's 11 for the detour routes that aren't on state 12 roads. 13 MR. WING: Right. Okay. 14 MR. ROGERS: So anything on a local street. 15 MR. WING: Those signs for those local routes 16 aren't called out in the plans. Are you 17 going to give us the signs we need to provide 18 to the city? The highway route signs are 19 called out but the local route signs are not 20 called out. 21 MR. ROGERS: The local detour is unsigned. 22 It's the official detour that's signed. 23 MR. WING: So then what signs are we 24 providing for the local detour routes? 25 MR. ROGERS: Nothing. 21 1 MR. WING: So the city is going to sign the 2 highway routes? 3 MR. GILLEN: Larry Gillen, Miller Brothers. 4 I think you're getting confused. The 5 official detour is the one that is signed. 6 The local detour is just a detour that the 7 city said is an informal one that someone is 8 going to take anyway. It doesn't get signed. 9 MR. WING: So the city forces are going to 10 sign the highway detour routes? 11 MR. GILLEN: For the official detour. The 12 one with the black arrows, we give them the 13 signs. 14 MR. ROGERS: Right. The official detours. 15 The local detours have to be done, from our 16 standpoint, from a design to kind of 17 investigate where we think the people are 18 going to go so we're not causing problems. 19 I know it looks somewhat confusing. 20 MR. WILLIAMS: Mel Williams. Kind of a 21 follow up with that. Some of that detour 22 that is being signed is on state routes, some 23 of it's on city streets. We're assuming the 24 entire detour, no matter where it's located 25 at, those signs are going to be installed by 22 1 the City of Toledo, the entire detour, not 2 just pieces of that detour? Do you see what 3 I mean? 4 MR. ROGERS: That's correct. You are 5 correct. I misstated previously. They're 6 going to handle the whole route. 7 MR. HINES: Denny Hines, Miller Brothers. 8 Page 10, the second column, there's a noise 9 ordinance for the time, and I know it's not 10 going to fly. 11 MR. ROGERS: We're required to put the note 12 into the plans because it is official city 13 policy. Like I said, the city's worked with 14 us on this project. And at any time after 15 the job you'd have to ask for a waiver from 16 that policy. 17 MR. HINES: You might as well ask for the 18 waiver from the city right now. You got to 19 bore those decks. They're going to back up 20 alarms. People aren't going to like it. 21 MR. WILLIAMS: Mel Williams. There's another 22 major item of work that has to be done at 23 night unless you let us close lanes in the 24 daytime. And that would be the removal of 25 the existing bridge decks. You have to take 23 1 out live traffic from below your removal? 2 MR. ROGERS: Right. 3 MR. WILLIAMS: So that's a function that 4 unless you close lanes on the expressway in 5 the daytime that is going to be violating the 6 noise ordinance and has to be done at night, 7 in my assumption? 8 MR. CHARVAT: Dennis Charvat with ODOT. I 9 think before we've always told the 10 contractors to anticipate the note being 11 waived at the time of bid, but we have to put 12 it in. Contractor has to write an official 13 letter to ODOT at the time of getting the 14 job. In the past we've always waived the 15 note. So bid it with anticipation the note 16 will be waived for construction. 17 MR. HINES: You will put that in the addendum 18 then, Dennis? 19 MR. CHARVAT: Denny, I believe we had it 20 stated that way before. If it's not correct 21 we'll make sure we state it differently in 22 the addendum. 23 MR. HINES: Denny Hines, Miller Brothers. On 24 Page 12 you got the Indiana bat note. I 25 don't think we're going to be done by April 24 1 15th. I don't know what your schedule 2 changes are going to do to that. If it's 3 going to be after September 15th we could 4 probably do that. But that means no work 5 until after September 15th on the trees 6 involved. 7 MR. ROGERS: We'll try to get a better 8 clarification. In the permits that we've 9 received, as indicated, there's potential for 10 Indiana bats, even within the actual bridge 11 structures. So we'll try to get a 12 clarification to try to waive that. I can't 13 promise that we can get it waived though. 14 MR. HINES: If you don't get it waived what 15 are you going to do with the completion date? 16 MR. ROGERS: That would be probably a good 17 question if you're concerned about the dates 18 at a later time. 19 MR. HINES: If they're on both Central and 20 Auburn, then you can't start either one of 21 those bridges until after September 15th. 22 Next year you have the same problem. 23 MR. ROGERS: Right. 24 MR. HINES: You'll have to get them down 25 early. 25 1 MR. ROGERS: We'll try. Obviously, it's in 2 our best interest to get them waived. 3 MR. GILLEN: Larry Gillen, Miller Brothers. 4 Are you saying the structure itself could 5 qualify? 6 MR. ROGERS: According to the nationwide 7 permit, yes. 8 MR. HINES: Denny Hines, Miller Brothers 9 again. Third column on Page 10 there's a 10 thing about benching foundation slopes. 11 There's a note there. And if you go back and 12 look through the plans it looks like you 13 waived that in follow-up cases. You've gone 14 to geotechnical bullet no. 2. There's a few 15 places you haven't. Talks about benching 16 foundation slopes. And if you follow 17 geotechnical bullet no. 2, it supersedes 18 that. I don't know if it supersedes that or 19 not. But on these plans it does. The fills 20 are built different than what they are with 21 just with benching in by the spec book. 22 MR. ROGERS: Trying to look for a 23 clarification to your question. You're 24 seeing a conflict between this note and what 25 you're seeing on the cross-sections for GB-2 26 1 related items? 2 MR. HINES: Yes. If you turn to Page 53 3 you've got a couple on it. There's some 4 other pages. 56 has got some on it. That's 5 following GB-2. Go to 58 -- on Page 58 it 6 shows it's a section that, 293 + 50, but at 7 293 it shows you added onto the slope. It 8 doesn't show that. So technically that's got 9 to be benched per the spec. I don't know 10 what you want. 11 MR. ROGERS: We'll look into the specific 12 locations you mentioned. Some of those 13 locations you're probably seeing is because 14 GB-2 requires certain heights. And that 15 might be under the height requirement of 16 GB-2. 17 I understand your concern though. You 18 want to be consistent in how you place the 19 material. 20 MR. HINES: If we've got to include the 21 excavation for the benching as part of our 22 work, you've got to put that in. If you're 23 going to include it as part of the 24 excavation, then you pay for it. But the 25 benching, we don't get paid for per the 27 1 specifications. 2 MR. ROGERS: Unless it's on the 3 cross-sections. 4 MR. HINES: Right. When you jump back and 5 forth we have some problems. Page 63's got 6 it on it. 66 has some. I don't know how far 7 you want me to go. 8 MR. ROGERS: That's okay. I understand your 9 concern. 10 MR. HINES: You understand the problem? 11 MR. ROGERS: Would it be possible for you to 12 ask an official question on the issue? 13 MR. HINES: Okay. 14 MR. ROGERS: I think that would help us give 15 you a better answer. 16 MR. HINES: Okay. Page 11, Column 2 you talk 17 about fill and plug existing conduit. I 18 think that's a, I'm going to call it 19 engineer's quantity or a quantity of some 20 kind. 21 And what controls a lot of cost and, 22 that's how big the pipe is. We have 23 absolutely no idea how big that pipe is and 24 how deep it is, what we got to do to get to 25 it. 28 1 MR. ROGERS: We'll try to get some more 2 detail, if possible. You understand, we're 3 trying to provide some flexibility, though? 4 MR. HINES: I understand what you're doing. 5 You make it very tough on the contractor 6 because we have no idea what you're going to 7 do. 8 MR. ROGERS: Correct. 9 MR. HINES: Denny Hines, Miller Brothers 10 again. On Page 12 there's a water quality 11 ex-filtration trench. I've looked at that 12 standard drawing and it shows it being curb 13 and gutter, and most of these are not in curb 14 and gutter, they're out. So they're past the 15 end of the curb and gutter. They go just to 16 the end of the curb and gutter and you put 17 them in. 18 MR. ROGERS: Okay. We'll take a look at the 19 location. And you're concerned about it 20 actually fitting in with the layout? 21 MR. HINES: Yes. 22 MR. ROGERS: Okay. 23 MR. HINES: It's in an asphalt section. They 24 show it concrete. The other thing, you don't 25 show any outlets to those things. I assume 29 1 you hook them up to the underdrains? But 2 there must be some pipe but not gutter 3 drains, unless they're just an evaporation 4 deal. 5 Page 29 on the lower right-hand side 6 corner there's a note about some D barrier 7 retaining wall shall be removed. Then at the 8 end it talks about reinstalling it. I don't 9 see a bid item for that. 10 MR. ROGERS: We'll clarify how that's paid 11 for. 12 MR. HINES: Page 31 you show some portable 13 concrete barrier and a line going over to 14 something and it doesn't go to anything, 15 either does the edge lines, the centerline. 16 The drum spacing is 20 feet but I don't see 17 any drums. 18 MR. ROGERS: That's one of our internal 19 questions right now. Thank you for asking. 20 MR. HINES: Okay. I'll go ahead. Sheet 33. 21 Left side toward the edge you've got 22 calculations. We need those calculations. 23 MR. ROGERS: We'll make sure that they're 24 posted. 25 MR. HINES: Do you know what street they go 30 1 to and what locations? 2 MR. ROGERS: We'll post those for you guys. 3 MR. HINES: Have you made peace with the city 4 traffic light department? 5 MR. ROGERS: The streetlights or the traffic 6 signals? 7 MR. HINES: Signals. 8 MR. ROGERS: Barb Jones has looked at the 9 material. Yes. 10 MR. HINES: They claim that works sometimes. 11 It can get pretty messy. I don't know what 12 they'll do with it. Their union claims that 13 work and we've had to jump through all kinds 14 of hoops for those guys. 15 MR. ROGERS: Any suggestions on -- 16 MR. HINES: Tell them they can't touch it. 17 Let the contractor take care of all of it. 18 They want to take the controller and redo the 19 controller and they want to do all kinds of 20 odds and ends. They do it and they got their 21 own time schedule and it's not very pretty. 22 MR. ROGERS: Did they try to interfere before 23 you're completed or after you're done with 24 it? 25 MR. HINES: Oh. They usually show up at the 31 1 preconstruction meeting and say we're going 2 to do -- they may decide they're going to 3 hang the signal head. They may decide 4 they're going to wire them. They may decide 5 they're going to take over the controller. 6 They do whatever they want to. 7 MR. ROGERS: We'll try to get an 8 understanding of who's doing what work and 9 who's in control. That may be a difficult 10 task. 11 MR. HINES: I'm done. 12 MR. WILLIAMS: Mel Williams with Miller 13 Brothers. Just a quick one. The steel grade 14 designation on the three bridges, Douglas 15 Road and Central are called out for A-70950W 16 steel, and Auburn's called out, I think this 17 is just the old designation, but it's 8588 18 Grade 50. I don't know when the fabricators 19 gets into this if that has an impact. 20 MR. EBERHARDT: It shouldn't have an impact. 21 MR. WILLIAMS: Because in the proposal they 22 just call it out as structural steel, no 23 grades or nothing. When you get into the 24 details -- 25 MR. ROGERS: We'll revise it to be consistent 32 1 with the other two in the addenda. 2 Any further questions? 3 MR. CRUICKSHANK: Brian Cruickshank with 4 Kiewit Western. With Addendum 1, being as 5 how we don't know when it's coming out, will 6 there be adequate time for questions to be 7 forwarded and responded to? 8 MR. ROGERS: The Federal Highways understand 9 the bidding process. So they're looking at 10 the material already. We're going to get it 11 done as fast as we can. I'm not going to 12 wait to try to give you guys one giant 13 addenda. As soon as I get the first 14 aesthetic addenda done, these questions, 15 among the other internal questions will be 16 developed as a second addenda to try not to 17 slow down the first one. 18 So I know you guys are time sensitive on 19 your bidding. We'll get things out as quick 20 as possible. The earlier in the process you 21 guys ask us questions that helps us 22 tremendously. If we get questions late, 23 right before bid, that creates a delay. 24 Usually we'll have to delay the sale. So we 25 appreciate the earlier questions. 33 1 I want to add, Federal Highways has 2 required that anything that changes quantity 3 they want to approve it before it goes out to 4 you guys first. So we have to go through 5 them. So keep that in mind. Even late in 6 the process. If we get a question on the day 7 of prebid lock down I'm going to have to send 8 it to Federal Highways and they're going to 9 have to approve it, if it changes quantity, 10 which is a little bit different than most 11 jobs. 12 MR. KETHEL: Is that just for this corridor 13 type stuff? Is that for all the jobs now? 14 MR. ROGERS: It will probably be for the 15 three projects related to the systems 16 interchange for sure. I'm not sure what 17 beyond that, what they're going to require. 18 That's a good question. I hope it's more 19 related to these bigger jobs. 20 Any other questions? I thank everybody 21 for coming today and good luck on your 22 bidding. If you have any questions, feel 23 free to submit them by official prebid 24 process. We can't answer questions directly 25 by phone, but we'll be more than happy, from 34 1 this point on, to answer questions through 2 the prebid process in Central Office. 3 (Proceedings concluded at 10:17 a.m.) 4 - - - 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 35 1 C E R T I F I C A T E 2 3 STATE OF OHIO ) 4 ) SS. 5 COUNTY OF LUCAS ) 6 7 I, Karen M. McCall Greene, the undersigned, do 8 hereby certify that the foregoing is a true, 9 correct and complete transcript of the proceedings 10 in the foregoing captioned matter taken by me and 11 transcribed from my stenographic notes. 12 IN WITNESS WHEREOF, I have hereunto set my hand 13 and affixed my notarial seal of office at Toledo, 14 Ohio, on this _______ day of May, 2008. 15 16 ------------------------------ 17 KAREN M. MCCALL GREENE 18 Notary Public in and for the 19 State of Ohio 20 21 My Commission expires December 10, 2010. 22 23 24 25